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Post by Greatestiam on Dec 18, 2011 18:26:51 GMT
Is evil just a tool against God’s boredom? All attempts to define a Shangri-La have failed because of boredom. An everlasting, non-changing environment, whatever it is, like heaven, would be quite boring. If you had absolutely no change in your life and no chance for change, how long would it take for you to get bored, if not go completely crazy, from life? Not long I would wager. God may have created man to change His boring existence. He may have chosen to add chaos to an otherwise unchanging system. To add evil where no evil was before. To add conflict and share his power with the forces of evil. In other words, did God need evil to give his own existence meaning? Take evil out of God’s systems and is there any reason for Him to continue living? Seems not. Is this why He lets evil continue? He must have some reason and the above seems to me to be the only way to justify the existence of evil and the fact that God does not end it. He, like humankind, needs evil, change and surprises to make life worth living. He could end evil anytime. The fact that He does not speaks volumes of God’s need for it. Is evil just a tool against God’s boredom or is there a better reason for God to leave it here with us? www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgjF4dYUhD8This clip puts the reason for evil as free will. I do not agree as if that were true, then God would not kill any of us as that would interfere with our free will choice to live. Either free will is sacred or it is not. It cannot be both violatable and non-violatable. Is God just bored and using us for entertainment? Regards DL
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roadwarrior
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Post by roadwarrior on Dec 20, 2011 12:26:14 GMT
Eternity is boring and life is just a game.
While that may be true, it is also true that we cannot understand what is "up" without having a "down". We cannot understand "cold" without a "hot". It's the duality of the Universe. Conversely, we cannot understand good without evil.
If God is truly omnipotent and omniscient then God would have known what Lucifer would do even before creating him. Therefore, it must all be part of the intent.
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Bayes
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Post by Bayes on Dec 20, 2011 18:24:00 GMT
I have a Christian friend who has basically this take on evil. he views the universe as something akin to a videogame that God is playing, and without evil in the mix it would be a very boring videogame.
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roadwarrior
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Post by roadwarrior on Dec 20, 2011 20:30:44 GMT
That is more cynical than I would phrase it, but may be correct. I like to think God is more mature about it than some teenager playing "Grand Theft Auto".
My girlfriend, who is much more conventionally Christian than I am, and I have had several discussions on related subjects. On difference in point of view is that she believes if one is good and one prays hard enough God will grant her a "red bicycle" (a euphemism for anything one seeks, desires or strives). I, OTOH, am much more Deist in my point of view. I believe God created the Universe and sets things in motion such as giving us brains and opportunities, but that it is up to us to earn our own bicycles if that is what we desire.
After all, what kind of "parent" would God be if we were given whatever we asked for? I believe that, while God is there, part of the reason we are in existence is to learn on our own. The main promise from God is that God is waiting on the other end of life like a catcher's mitt for our souls.
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Post by Greatestiam on Dec 22, 2011 21:15:46 GMT
Eternity is boring and life is just a game. While that may be true, it is also true that we cannot understand what is "up" without having a "down". We cannot understand "cold" without a "hot". It's the duality of the Universe. Conversely, we cannot understand good without evil. If God is truly omnipotent and omniscient then God would have known what Lucifer would do even before creating him. Therefore, it must all be part of the intent. Yes. And if that is true then God also planned to have his son murdered when there was no need to. It was God's plan from the beginning to have Adam and Eve eat the forbidden fruit. This can be demonstrated by the fact that the bible says that Jesus "was crucified from the foundations of the Earth," that is to say, God planned to crucify Jesus as atonement for sin before he even created human beings or God damned sin. If God had not intended humans to sin from the beginning, why did he build into the Creation this "solution" for sin? Why create a solution for a problem you do not anticipate? God knew that the moment he said "don't eat from that tree," the die was cast. The eating was inevitable. Eve was merely following the plan. What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to? Only an insane God. That’s who. The cornerstone of Christianity is human sacrifice, thus showing it‘s immorality. Regards DL
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Post by Greatestiam on Dec 22, 2011 21:17:18 GMT
I have a Christian friend who has basically this take on evil. he views the universe as something akin to a videogame that God is playing, and without evil in the mix it would be a very boring videogame. Every hero needs a challenger. Regards DL
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Post by Greatestiam on Dec 22, 2011 21:20:53 GMT
That is more cynical than I would phrase it, but may be correct. I like to think God is more mature about it than some teenager playing "Grand Theft Auto". My girlfriend, who is much more conventionally Christian than I am, and I have had several discussions on related subjects. On difference in point of view is that she believes if one is good and one prays hard enough God will grant her a "red bicycle" (a euphemism for anything one seeks, desires or strives). I, OTOH, am much more Deist in my point of view. I believe God created the Universe and sets things in motion such as giving us brains and opportunities, but that it is up to us to earn our own bicycles if that is what we desire. After all, what kind of "parent" would God be if we were given whatever we asked for? I believe that, while God is there, part of the reason we are in existence is to learn on our own. The main promise from God is that God is waiting on the other end of life like a catcher's mitt for our souls. Yep. To catch us or to let us fall into eternal torture and flame. Scriptures say more burn than are caught. Regards DL
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roadwarrior
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Post by roadwarrior on Dec 23, 2011 2:18:17 GMT
Yes. And if that is true then God also planned to have his son murdered when there was no need to. LOL. Nice twist, but wrong. OTOH, given the content of the rest of your diatribe, I think I see your logic: 1. God is evil. 2. Only insane people will follow an evil god. 3. I don't so I'm sane. Yeah, I get it. Oh, by the way, Jesus crawled up that cross willingly. While being executed in such a painful and gruesome manner is terrible, knowing that one has eternal life on the other side of mortal death is a big plus.
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Bayes
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Post by Bayes on Dec 23, 2011 18:33:35 GMT
Eternity is boring and life is just a game. While that may be true, it is also true that we cannot understand what is "up" without having a "down". We cannot understand "cold" without a "hot". It's the duality of the Universe. Conversely, we cannot understand good without evil. If God is truly omnipotent and omniscient then God would have known what Lucifer would do even before creating him. Therefore, it must all be part of the intent. Yes. And if that is true then God also planned to have his son murdered when there was no need to. It was God's plan from the beginning to have Adam and Eve eat the forbidden fruit. This can be demonstrated by the fact that the bible says that Jesus "was crucified from the foundations of the Earth," that is to say, God planned to crucify Jesus as atonement for sin before he even created human beings or God damned sin. If God had not intended humans to sin from the beginning, why did he build into the Creation this "solution" for sin? Why create a solution for a problem you do not anticipate? God knew that the moment he said "don't eat from that tree," the die was cast. The eating was inevitable. Eve was merely following the plan. What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to? Only an insane God. That’s who. The cornerstone of Christianity is human sacrifice, thus showing it‘s immorality. Regards DL I would not call someone who plays the sims and allows some of their sims to die insane.
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Post by Greatestiam on Dec 24, 2011 18:03:31 GMT
Yes. And if that is true then God also planned to have his son murdered when there was no need to. LOL. Nice twist, but wrong. OTOH, given the content of the rest of your diatribe, I think I see your logic: 1. God is evil. 2. Only insane people will follow an evil god. 3. I don't so I'm sane. Yeah, I get it. Oh, by the way, Jesus crawled up that cross willingly. While being executed in such a painful and gruesome manner is terrible, knowing that one has eternal life on the other side of mortal death is a big plus. You mean that Jesus could have gone against God's great plan? Tsk tsk. It was God's plan from the beginning to have Adam and Eve eat the forbidden fruit. This can be demonstrated by the fact that the bible says that Jesus "was crucified from the foundations of the Earth," that is to say, God planned to crucify Jesus as atonement for sin before he even created human beings or God damned sin. If God had not intended humans to sin from the beginning, why did he build into the Creation this "solution" for sin? Why create a solution for a problem you do not anticipate? God knew that the moment he said "don't eat from that tree," the die was cast. The eating was inevitable. Eve was merely following the plan. What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to? Only an insane God. That’s who. The cornerstone of Christianity is human sacrifice, thus showing it‘s immorality. www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYaQpRZJl18&feature=relatedwww.youtube.com/watch?v=B-91mSkxaXsRegards DL
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Post by Greatestiam on Dec 24, 2011 18:07:11 GMT
[ I would not call someone who plays the sims and allows some of their sims to die insane. I am French. You would have to use a different English for me to know what you said. If you mean it is all fantasy and myth then I agree. Regards DL
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roadwarrior
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Post by roadwarrior on Dec 27, 2011 2:14:42 GMT
I would not call someone who plays the sims and allows some of their sims to die insane. The "Sims" don't die. They are well cared for after "the game".
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roadwarrior
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Post by roadwarrior on Dec 27, 2011 2:17:00 GMT
What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to? Only an insane God. That’s who. Why is it insane when Jesus knew he was joining God? As it is, I think you are confusing God's plan with man's interpretation of that plan.
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Bayes
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Post by Bayes on Dec 29, 2011 17:50:52 GMT
[ I would not call someone who plays the sims and allows some of their sims to die insane. I am French. You would have to use a different English for me to know what you said. If you mean it is all fantasy and myth then I agree. Regards DL I was referencing a popular video game in which the player is something very akin to a personal god.
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roadwarrior
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Post by roadwarrior on Dec 30, 2011 15:19:20 GMT
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